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mad matz


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French winch wagon
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Hi  folks !  I am  working on a  72nd scale diorama with a french caquot balloon (the roseplane vacu),the balloon itself is finished ,now I start scratchbuilding the motorized winch . A couple of years ago I took some fotos of it at Le Bourget musee del air,but somehow forgot to look for the manufacturer and the fotos turned out poor quality. I found some pictures of it in a french magazine ,but without a description.All I know is that its not a Latil, for it lacks the characteristic shape of the Latil's hood,the one i mean has astraight hood.I searched the whole landships forum without result.Does anybody on this forum have further information ?

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Rectalgia


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Sadly, I don't. Wings of War chapter XXIII mentions French winches and American production of them and has a photo of a "6-Cylinder, 100-H. P. Rear Windlass Engine Caterpillar, Tractor Adapter, for Towing and Controlling Observation Balloons" but I'm guessing that is one of their developments - http://www.allworldwars.com/WingsOfWarByTheodoreKnappen.html#XXIII - picture http://www.allworldwars.com/image/035/Wingsofwar032.jpg.

There are pictures of some sort of balloon tenders at http://www.allworldwars.com/image/035/Wingsofwar035.jpg (American again). and http://www.nuveforum.net/attachments/4329d1214915433-caquot-balloon-jpg (unspecified allied, Western front).

-- Edited by Rectalgia on Tuesday 11th of May 2010 08:28:09 PM

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Facimus et Frangimus
28juni14


Hero

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The French used a lorry borne wench.   Primary vehicle in use was the Delahaye fitted with the Voiture-treuil. (  If there were other manufacturers, I'm unaware of them and have photo evidence of only the 1911 touring car conversion,  and the purpose built Delahaye 1915. )  
This vehicle was also supplied to the AEF for their Balloon Service in 1918.  Also, I suspect numbers may have been used by the BEF,  but I have no photo evidence. ( As you may know,  the Brits didn't allow private camera use;   while every German grenadier and his uncle must have carried a Kodak into combat.



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Thomas Buecheler


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Hello mad matz

In February I visited the museum at Le Bourget.

It's a Delahaye. This winch was used to tether Caquot captive balloons and Saconney kits.

During my visit I made a walk-around of about 60 - 70 photographs. There are a number of detail shots, too.

If you're interested I could make a CD with these photographs.

Hope this helps.

Regards
Thomas

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mad matz


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thank you all for your replies, I found out by now that the winch truck is indeed a delahaye .on the internet I finally found a really interesting site including lots of phtos and a video by simply spelling it in french: treuil automobile delahaye and bingo ! there it is. only problem its all in french. If I find out how to post Photos I'm going to show you some of my dios eventually. Matz

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Rectalgia


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mad matz wrote:

...only problem its all in french. ...

Ah, if you paste in

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&sl=fr&u=

in front of the page address (URL) at the top of your browser window (leave no gap) then hit enter it should translate all that text into German for you. That is no help with the video but at least it translates the text. Or change the hl=de part to hl=en for English, etc.


-- Edited by Rectalgia on Saturday 15th of May 2010 06:15:49 PM

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28juni14


Hero

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Back to this old tread if there is still interest;  .... attached is the only horse drawn wench wagon I've seen in French service.  You will note the cabel rising vertically from the guide pullies.

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kieffer


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Hi 28juni14,

that's a great picture! Lots of details to study, just great. I wonder how the steam engine was fired, with oil?

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ALVF


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Hello,

The french winchs in service during the 1914-1918 war were:

-1879 model, horse drawn winch wagon with steam engine fired with coal.This vehicle was studied by Colonel Charles Renard and was still in service in 1914 for use with old spherical balloons.

-for the new balloons "H" type (similar to "Drachen"), "L" and various "Caquot" balloons, model"M", "R", "N", "NN", the winch was carried by:

-"voiture-treuil 1915-type Saconney" on Delahaye type 78 truck (32 HP).

-"voiture-treuil 1916-type Saconney" on Delahaye type 80 truck (60 HP).

-"voiture-treuil 1917-type Caquot" on Latil truck "type T.P. série A, court". (four drive truck 4 X 4).

All these models are depicted in official military manuals:
-"Instruction pratique sur les aérostats militaires"-1887.
-"Instruction pratique sur les ballons captifs militaires"-2ème partie "Description des matériels"-1918.
-""Instruction pratique sur les manoeuvres des ballons militaires"-1ère partie-"Description du matériel technique"-1925.
The most outstanding material is the model 1917 on Latil truck, a very advanced design for its time.
Yours sincerely,
Guy François.


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28juni14


Hero

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Bonjour!

Your response is most informative Guy,  and fills a knowledge void for me.

It would appear you have access to official French manuals.   Can you advise any information on French horse drawn vehicles ?   I allude to the following:

Chariot-Fourragere Mle 1884

Fourgon Mle 1887

Though I have a copy of Reglement de Manoeuvre de L'Artillerie,  still I'm lacking dimensional data:  wheel diameter, vehicle length & width.

Any assistance you might provide would be most appreciated.




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ALVF


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Hello,

Dimensional data for "Chariot-Fourragère de batterie" from "Aide-Mémoire des 0fficiers d'Artillerie"-1886 edition: great work in 23 volumes!

-length: 4,030 mètres.

-width: 0,996 mètre.

-wheels:
-avant-train de chariot:...."roue n° 3 bis": 1,14 mètre.
-arrière-train de chariot:..."roue n° 2 bis de campagne": 1,40 mètre.

I search the data for "Fourgon Mle 1887".

Yours sincerely,
Guy François.




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28juni14


Hero

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Excellent, Guy!

Now I can likely work from the drawing with reasonable accuracy.

Incidently,  I've attached my best photo of the vehicle should anyone be interested.

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