Landships II

Geeze Tim! :)

You have a multitude of pictures on just about EVERY facite of WWI combat, but you don't have pictures of these two ships? I'm apalled!

Don't worry, I'm just joking :) :) :)

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I posted such a question on another forum, the replies I got were:

'There's "Big Gun Monitors" by Ian Buxton, 1978, US Naval Institute, subtitled "the history of the design, construction and operation of the Royal Navy's monitors".'

However, that book would seem to deal with the Royal Navys super huge BIG gun monitors they used for coastal bombardment pre-WWI all the way up till WWII. They dont even really look like monitor ships. Cool looking! But definitely not a monitor in the classic sense.

Here are some pics of what a Big Gun RN monitor would look like. This sucker is the HMS Roberts. The first Roberts was a WWI BG Monitor, the second was a much cooler looking WWII BG Monitor that participated in the Normandy Invasion, using its two gigantic 15 inch guns to bombard the coast.




'Osprey publishes a number of books on the subject:

- Union River Ironclads 1861–65
- Confederate Ironclads 1861–65
- Union Monitor classes 1861–65

(www.ospreypublishing.com)'

'If you are interested in reading about the Royal Navys River Gun boats I can recomend
Armed With Stings by A Cecil Hampshire, The story of the Insect Class from WW1til the end of WW2. A very good read.'

And there is also 'H.M.S. Saracen, by Douglas Reeman.', which is about a BG British Monitor that is used in WWI, and later on when thoroughly obsolete participates in WWI also. Its a ficticious story. And, again, it deals with one of those massive Big Gun Monitors, which arent really true montitors anyways.

My one and only source book is Janes Fighting Ships Of World War I. I think its on the pricier side, but it has loads of great information, although it obviously doesn't focus on the monitors.

If you have trouble finding any of these, I can suggest www.ebay.com, and www.bibliofind.com.

The USA actually used river monitors in Vietnam. They built these suckers with the exact philosophy of the monitor. Low draft, low freeboard, dont give the enemy much to shoot at. However, because they wanted it to be very very simple, they had to give them a fair bit of freeboard. That would allow there to be a sunken in area of the ship for soldiers to be in, without the worry of it filling up with water and the boat sinking. As far as I know, they were they most recent monitors ever buil. I dont know if any navy in the world currently employs designs with that philosophy.



Monitor ships... The one and only class of ship where THIS is considered NORMAL, and not -VERY- bad.

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Yes army book has some really good titles I am in the process of going through a bad experiance with armybook though
so I dont know if I will order there again.

A bit earlier than WWI, but if you're interested in the development of breastwork monitors and suchlike, then a book entitled "Birth of the British Battleship" by John Beeler covering British (but refers also to other countries) Capital Ship design 1870 - 1881.  The British developed two distincltly different kind of ship - the local one for service in the Atlantic and Med coastal areas of Europe - and a "Cruising" Battleship that still had rigging and was for use on the far side of the Atlantic and other far away stations.  The first British Ironclad Dreadnought was effectively a monitor for operating in large rivers and against defended ports and forts. The book is readily available on abebooks at wildly differing prices.  As a treatise on the rapid changes in technology and strategic thinking affecting ship design for armament, type of power, armour, etc, it is a fascinating book.

The Aussies have the wreck of a breastwork monitor that they're trying to recover and refurbish to a limited extent called HMVS Cerberus, bought by the State of Victoria to defend it against a possible Russian (!) invasion.  There is a website and 1/250 plans for paper or plastic card.

Tony 

Roger Todd wrote:

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I hope the Aussies can recover and restore the 'Cerberus'. There are another couple of early turret ships still around in good order - the Dutch 'Buffel' and the Chilean 'Huascar', both equipped with Coles turrets.

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The 'Cerberus' is also available as a free paper model from http://www.papershipwright.co.uk/index.html in its 1871 configuration or from http://www.cerberus.com.au/ for $A25 (delivered to the US or Europe) in its 1890's configuration. Both models are 1:250 scale.
 
BTW, I have no commercial link to either of these organisations. I just like card models!

I think I'm right in saying that the philosopher Ludwig Wittgenstein served on one of the Danube monitors for a while. Don't know how that helps, but I thought I'd mention it. You could make a little scale model of him having a think.

Hi Vilkata, all!

Here are some recent pictures of the Austro-Hungarian Leitha (later renamed as Lajta)monitor, the oldest surviving monitor. It is currently in a Shipmuseum in Neszmely, Hungary:

http://www.europahajo.hu/neszmely/site.php?content=lajtaf

The brief history of the Leitha in 5 pictures. The second from the top (in blue) shows her after the 1894 modification:

http://www.papernet.hu/?l=sdetails&lang=hun&i=1427

Lajta Monitor Shipping Foundation - intended to preserving and reconstructing Leitha. (Also has english text):

http://magazin.navigare.hu/flottilla/laj_1.shtml
http://magazin.navigare.hu/flottilla/laj_2.shtml
http://magazin.navigare.hu/flottilla/2002.shtml

-- Edited by McGuba at 09:43, 2007-02-05

If I may chime in on this subject.....   There are actually two surviving members of the K.u.K. Danauflotille.  In addition to the Leitha( now restored to it's original 1880s configerations; not WW1 ),  the other monitor is the SMS Bodrog, or SAVA as it became after leaving KuK service.   Last I heard the stripped down hull was residing in present day Croatia.

I do hope the British monitor, M33, is made more visitor friendly - at the moment you can only view it in drydock, although there was a plan to cut a huge hole in the side for wheelchair access direct into the hull. There's three WW1 Royal Navy ships surviving - M33 as mentioned, HMS Caroline, a wonderful Jutland veteran Cruiser which is now, at long long last, finally going to be restored as a museum exhibit I believe in Belfast, and HMS President, ex-HMS Saxifrage, a Q ship, which is a floating bar!

Not quite ships though - I presume the aircraft carrier you refer to is the lighter at the Fleet Air Arm Museum?

Nice little clip at www.laht.com/article.asp?ArticleId=19422      Hulk is visible on Google Earth, search Ada Huja, Belgrade  and look for two hulls on South bank a bit less than 1km to the Right of the bridge. I have US Navy issue postcards for most US Monitors built post 1868, will try to post a link to photos & histories within next 30 days.

Interesting developments re M33 - take a look at

www.indiegogo.com/projects/hms-m-33%3Acontribute