Landships II

Also Germany concered French, Belgian and British (or maybe Canadian) flags.

I don't know exactly which country it was (but definetly a Commonwelth country), but in the 1920ies (or early 30ies) some flags were given back from Germany.

I'm with PDA regards the carrying of "the colours" into battle - however the odd national flag finds itself on the front line and there was the celebrated Irish Guards incident at the "Battle of the Rivers" (9 Sep 1914).  Journalists of course loved such tales.

here's a picture of a French officer leading his troop in Champagne.

Most interesting does any one know more about later french flags, I have seen many pics of french flags with battle damage earlier in the war but nothing later...
My respect for Airfix is growing more and more every day...

Cheers

Some great information coming out here! "Colours", Guidons and Standards are the "heart and soul" of the regiments/fighting arms which bear them (never doubt it), a rallying point representing the tangible embodiment of the State's devolved authority to, and trust in, those arms. Correspondingly, their loss would be an insurmountable catastrophe/disgrace. In practice, they were (and remain) a chivalric artifact with the potential halt a battle somewhere short of the total overwhelming and/or annihilation of one or both sides. Accordingly, although once 'routine', it was an act of extraordinary courage and confidence to take them into battle. I had thought such had passed from the world before WW1 and the 20th Century's "new kind of war" (as it was then), but evidently not. I am quite unable to decide how to feel about it, it is staggering, it is uplifting, it is tragic.

Thanks Marty, Kieffer and Michel.

Steve

Rectalgia wrote:

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I had thought such had passed from the world before WW1 and the 20th Century's "new kind of war" (as it was then), but evidently not. I am quite unable to decide how to feel about it, it is staggering, it is uplifting, it is tragic.

 

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Hi Steve,

I agree, it's hard to find the words for it. It seems that standards and flags are incorporating more than just a symbol or recognition sign. Especially when things come to the matter a regimental or other flag can play a rather emotional role. That even happened in ww2, some stories about garrisons who were allowed to march of after surrender with the standard in front of the troops, standards who were kept out of enemies hands by an officer, wearing it under his tunique etc. They apparantly can have an almost sacral character. And they still do, as many constitutional laws prescribe how to handle the national colours. Many 'boys' from my generation will certainly remember the sound of the bell on the parade ground before the flag was raised in the morning and lowered in the evening. Even when you were somewhere completely alone you had to stand still and salute, a bit bizar. Officially,'over here' a flag fallen on the ground has to be burned discretely...did some angry people in some different regions hear something about that as it seems rather popular to stamp on the foes flag with your feet and burn it afterwards?

Regards, Kieffer

 

other belligerent standards and flags:
German marines in Africa, though the painting is apparantly pre ww1, 1902 by Carl Roechling. Waving  the naval flag, with the 'schwarz weiss rot' flag in the corner and the Adler in the centre. I think it's the Prussian eagle, I heard once the story that its head is turned to the left (west). towards the French showing no fear.
Mr. Elabavaro, please feel free to correct me, I guess you're the expert!

second picture: Italians of the Lombardia Brigade. The brigade comprised the 73th and 74th infantry. The colour bearer is a sub lieutenant (one star), a lieutenant on his left (two stars) and a colonel on his right with three stars and lacing.

Hi Pat,

Photography wasn't that easy these days I presume, carrying a bulky camera, needing a tripod etc. Apart from life danger and restrictions from chiefs of staff.

Kieffer

Bonjour Michel,

thank you for this information, magnifique!
One of the RICM pictures on your lead shows another habit: holding the flag in the river that's taken, I guess this is the Rhine. There's a picture of Italian ww1 soldiers, I think they doped their flag in the river Piave. Talking about the quasi-religious character, as Pat mentioned it before...
RICM: called a colonial regiment, but if I am correct the troops were French, or French living in the colonies?

Kieffer


-- Edited by kieffer on Wednesday 29th of September 2010 09:07:27 AM

Again, many thanks to those who provided information.

I am still under the impression flags were rarely carried into combat, at least after 1914, and therefore (but also for the other reasons mentioned above) photographic evidence is the rare exception.

It goes without saying there are plenty of drawings of flags during action, and photos of flags under other circumstances. Regards, Pat

If someone is still following this, the Bavarian army museum keeps an impressive flag collection, including _all_ the regimental flags that still existed in 1918. This page and one pdf at the bottom of it show quite a lot of images, while the other pdf gives an excellent historical overview, saying the 1808 (eightteen-eight) flags were still in use in WW1 with Reserve and Landwehr units, but all flags were withdrawn in 1915 since trench warfare made them obsolete.
http://www.armeemuseum.de/en/collections/banners-and-flags.html

The text is in German only, and only a fraction of the apparently excellent museum collections are accessible to the public.

Thanks Ironsides,very nice collection of images. Regards, Pat

Paining by Leo Adler in 1926 - acknowledged for its fidelity to detail according to this reference - http://www.landesmuseum.at/pdf_frei_remote/Fuehrer_1978_0171-0178.pdf (last page). As described in your link Pat, an extraordinary feat of arms and one which is said to have won the admiration of the Russian adversary, themselves well remembered for their gallantry and daring from times of old. At the end of day, Austrian casualties were very light by the gauge of the Great War - 13 dead, 314 wounded and 59 missing - yet the claim is 3,000 Russians captured along with 36 guns, so no minor action despite those low casualties. Hard to assess without more information but a source of great pride which seems rare in the German and A-H sphere, at least in contemporary society.